Bible Teachings or Traditions of Men?

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Re: Bible Teachings or Traditions of Men?

Post  Alter2Ego on Sun 16 Nov 2014, 7:33 pm

Waqar Daniel wrote:
[*]"Then the Lord God said, 'Behold, the man has become like one of Us, knowing good and evil; and now, lest he stretch out his hand, and take also from the tree of life, and eat, and live forever -'" (Genesis 3:22)


ALTER2EGO -to- WAQAR DANIEL:

Fail.  Genesis 3:22 was written at a time when there were millions of angels in existence.  Jehovah was talking to one of the angels or angels.


Waqar Daniel wrote:[*]"Come, let Us go down and there confuse their language, that they may not understand one another’s speech." (Genesis 11:7)


Another fail.  You are using the same personal pronouns "us" and "our" to make the same ridiculous argument.  Whenever the "us" and "our" pronouns are used in the Bible and Jehovah is the speaker, it means he is talking to an angel or angels.  This view is confirmed by the following source:

The answer emerges from the Torah and its Prophets. If you search the Hebrew Bible you will find that when the Almighty speaks of “us” or “our,” He is addressing His ministering angels. In fact, only two chapters later, God continues to use the pronoun “us” as He speaks with His angels. At the end of the third chapter of Genesis the Almighty relates to His angels that Adam and his wife have eaten from the Tree of Knowledge and must therefore be prevented from eating from the Tree of Life as well; for if man would gain access to the Tree of Life he will “become like one of us.” The Creator then instructs his burning angels, known as Cherubim, to stand at the entrance to the gate of the Garden of Eden, waving a flaming sword to prevent man from entering the Garden and eating from the Tree of Life. Let’s examine this famed text:

Then the Lord God said, “Behold, the man has become like one of Us, to know good and evil. And now, lest he put out his hand and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live forever” – therefore the Lord God sent him out of the Garden of Eden to till the ground from which he was taken. So He drove out the man; and He placed cherubim at the east of the Garden of Eden, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to guard the way to the tree of life.
(Genesis 3:22-24)
http://outreachjudaism.org/trinity-genesis/

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Re: Bible Teachings or Traditions of Men?

Post  Alter2Ego on Sun 16 Nov 2014, 8:40 pm

Waqar Daniel wrote:
Alter2Ego wrote:Notice that I bolded in light blue the words Us and Our in the quotation you presented from Genesis 1:26.  Whenever the pronouns "us" and "our" are used in the Old Testament and Jehovah is part of the conversation, it means Almighty God was speaking to at least one of his millions of spirit sons/angels.
VS
Alter2Ego wrote:In other words, at Genesis 1:26 when Jehovah said "let us make man in our image," he was specifically talking to the angel identified as the pre-human Jesus Christ.  We know this is the case, because Colossians 1:15-17 tells us that God created Jesus Christ as the "firstborn of all creation," and that Jehovah created all other things through or by means of the pre-human Jesus.

Don't you think you are confused here. At one point in the same post you are saying that ...it means Almighty God was speaking to at least one of his millions of spirit sons/angels and at the point you say that ...he was specifically talking to the angel identified as pre-human Jesus Christ.

So my question here is, whom was God the Father was speaking to

  1. At least one of his millions of spirit sons/angels;
  2. Jesus Christ the Son of the God Most High?


ALTER2EGO -to- WAQAR DANIEL:

There is no such thing as "vs" with my above comments, because those two comments are not competing with each other.  They are both truthful. You are familiar with the "either/or" positions; are you not?  EITHER/OR means both comments are correct, based upon the circumstances.

Let me break it down further, since you are having a hard time getting this point:  Whenever "us" and "our" is used within one of Jehovah's sentences, it means he is EITHER talking to one of his angelic sons OR several of his angelic sons.  In my second comment, copied above, I clarified that in the case of Genesis 1:26, where Jehovah said: "Let us make man in our image," the Almighty was specifically talking to the pre-human Jesus Christ.  In other words, Jehovah was not talking to several of his angelic sons, he was speaking to one specific angelic son--the pre-human Jesus Christ.

This is confirmed at Colossians 1:15-17 where we are told Jesus was the first to be BORN aka CREATED, after which Jehovah created all other things through or by means of the pre-human Jesus Christ.


"{15} He [Jesus] is the image of the invisible God, the FIRSTBORN OF ALL CREATION; {16} because by means of him [Jesus] all other things were created in the heavens and upon the earth, the things visible and the things invisible, no matter whether they are thrones or lordships or governments or authorities. All other things have been created THROUGH him and for him. {17} Also, he is before all other things and by means of him [Jesus] all other things were made to exist." (Colossians 1:15-17 -- New World Translation)


Jehovah alone is Creator.  He is the power behind the creating of everything.  But he worked through Jesus Christ, as stated at Colossians 1:16-17.

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Re: Bible Teachings or Traditions of Men?

Post  Waqar Daniel on Tue 18 Nov 2014, 2:44 pm

Alter2Ego wrote:Fail.  Genesis 3:22 was written at a time when there were millions of angels in existence.  Jehovah was talking to one of the angels or angels.
Show me where did I say that at the time of Adam there were no angels. i simply said that God the Father conversed with Jesus the Son. By misquoting me you have lied again.
Alter2Ego wrote:Another fail.  You are using the same personal pronouns "us" and "our" to make the same ridiculous argument.  Whenever the "us" and "our" pronouns are used in the Bible and Jehovah is the speaker, it means he is talking to an angel or angels.  This view is confirmed by the following
This fact that you have given from Outreach Judaism is rubbish as Jews do not believe in Trinity and neither Jesus.

Let me give you another view that will support your point and you can quote it on other discussions too where you are challenging Christianity
""O People of the Book! Commit no excesses in your religion:  nor say Of Allah ought but the truth.  Christ Jesus the son of Mary was (no more than) A Messenger of Allah, And His Word, which He bestowed on Mary, and the Spirit proceeding From Him: so believe In Allah and His Messengers.  Say not "Trinity":  desist: It will be better for you:  For Allah is One God:  Glory to Him:  (Far Exalted is He) above Having a son.  To Him (Allah) Belong all things in the heavens And on earth.  And enough Is Allah as a Disposer of affairs." (Surah 4 Verses 171-172)
You can quote many heresies and lies as facts as you want. Nice Try but it was utterly rubbish.
Alter2Ego wrote:There is no such thing as "vs" with my above comments, because those two comments are not competing with each other.  They are both truthful. You are familiar with the "either/or" positions; are you not?  EITHER/OR means both comments are correct, based upon the circumstances. Let me break it down further, since you are having a hard time getting this point:  Whenever "us" and "our" is used within one of Jehovah's sentences, it means he is EITHER talking to one of his angelic sons OR several of his angelic sons.  In my second comment, copied above, I clarified that in the case of Genesis 1:26, where Jehovah said: "Let us make man in our image," the Almighty was specifically talking to the pre-human Jesus Christ.  In other words, Jehovah was not talking to several of his angelic sons, he was speaking to one specific angelic son--the pre-human Jesus Christ.
You are totally wrong, when God conversed with Angels in Genesis 18 while visiting Abraham Jesus used "I" and not "us".
Alter2Ego wrote:This is confirmed at Colossians 1:15-17 where we are told Jesus was the first to be BORN aka CREATED, after which Jehovah created all other things through or by means of the pre-human Jesus Christ. "{15} He [Jesus] is the image of the invisible God, the FIRSTBORN OF ALL CREATION; {16} because by means of him [Jesus] all other things were created in the heavens and upon the earth, the things visible and the things invisible, no matter whether they are thrones or lordships or governments or authorities. All other things have been created THROUGH him and for him. {17} Also, he is before all other things and by means of him [Jesus] all other things were made to exist." (Colossians 1:15-17 -- New World Translation)
I asked you that if I use your logic then your parents are your creators and not God because you are born of them and this point is supported by all the definitions you have given from dictionaries.

Secondly I asked if Jesus is created then how can a created being become a creator??? So here goes your facts in smoke once again. Kindly answer my questions if you want to further carry on with the discussion.

Please do answer this question

Is Jesus Jehovah? If "no" then who is Jesus - A God?


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Re: Bible Teachings or Traditions of Men?

Post  Alter2Ego on Tue 18 Nov 2014, 5:58 pm

Waqar Daniel wrote:
Alter2Ego wrote:Fail.  Genesis 3:22 was written at a time when there were millions of angels in existence.  Jehovah was talking to one of the angels or angels.
Show me where did I say that at the time of Adam there were no angels. i simply said that God the Father conversed with Jesus the Son. By misquoting me you have lied again.

ALTER2EGO -to- WAQAR DANIEL:

The thing speaks for itself.  The fact that you keep using Genesis 1:26 and other similar verses where Jehovah uses the personal pronouns "US" and "OUR" indicates you believe there were no other beings in existence and that God was talking to himself in trinity.

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Re: Bible Teachings or Traditions of Men?

Post  Alter2Ego on Tue 18 Nov 2014, 6:05 pm

Waqar Daniel wrote:
Alter2Ego wrote:Another fail.  You are using the same personal pronouns "us" and "our" to make the same ridiculous argument.  Whenever the "us" and "our" pronouns are used in the Bible and Jehovah is the speaker, it means he is talking to an angel or angels.  This view is confirmed by the following
This fact that you have given from Outreach Judaism is rubbish as Jews do not believe in Trinity and neither Jesus.

ALTER2EGO -to- WAQAR DANIEL:

Now you are snatching at straws. Your argument is weak. Of course the Jews do not believe in Jesus.  What has that to do with the fact that they confirmed what the scripture says by literally quoting scripture to confirm their comment?  

The people from Outreach Judaism stated that Jehovah happened to be speaking to angelic beings whenever he used the expressions US and OUR.  They proved it by quoting scripture from Genesis 3:22-24 where some of the ministering angels were posted near the entrance of the Garden of Eden with a flaming sword--in direct response to Jehovah's use of the personal pronoun "US". The angels were posted at the entrance to the garden of Eden immediately after Jehovah used the personal pronoun "US".  Notice below.


"{22} And Jehovah went on to say: 'Here the man has become like one of US in knowing good and bad, and now in order that he may not put his hand out and actually take fruit also from the tree of life and eat and live to time indefinite," {23} With that Jehovah God put him [Adam] out of the garden of Eden to cultivate the ground from which he had been taken. {24} And he [Jehovah] drove the man out and posted at the east of the garden of Eden the cherubs [angels] and the flaming blade of a sword that was turning itself continually to guard the way to the tree of life." (Genesis 3:22-24)

Notice from the scriptural account above, at verse 22, Jehovah used the personal pronoun "US", just as he used it at Genesis 1:26 when he said "let us make man in our image."  Notice that in direct response to Jehovah's use of the word "US" at verse 22, he posted cherubs with an "s" (more than one angels) rather than cherub (one single angel).

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Re: Bible Teachings or Traditions of Men?

Post  Alter2Ego on Tue 18 Nov 2014, 6:13 pm

Waqar Daniel wrote:
Alter2Ego wrote:There is no such thing as "vs" with my above comments, because those two comments are not competing with each other.  They are both truthful. You are familiar with the "either/or" positions; are you not?  EITHER/OR means both comments are correct, based upon the circumstances. Let me break it down further, since you are having a hard time getting this point:  Whenever "us" and "our" is used within one of Jehovah's sentences, it means he is EITHER talking to one of his angelic sons OR several of his angelic sons.  In my second comment, copied above, I clarified that in the case of Genesis 1:26, where Jehovah said: "Let us make man in our image," the Almighty was specifically talking to the pre-human Jesus Christ.  In other words, Jehovah was not talking to several of his angelic sons, he was speaking to one specific angelic son--the pre-human Jesus Christ.
You are totally wrong, when God conversed with Angels in Genesis 18 while visiting Abraham Jesus used "I" and not "us".

ALTER2EGO -to- WAQAR DANIEL:

Jesus did not visit Abraham at Genesis 18.  The context to those verses makes it clear that three angels appeared to Abraham, and that one of them stayed behind talking to Abraham and thereby became Jehovah's chief spokesman at that time.  For that reason, Abraham referred to him as "Jehovah".  Abraham did not refer to him as "Jesus".


"{1} Afterward Jehovah appeared to him [Abraham] among the big trees of Mamre, while he was sitting at the entrance of the tent about the heat of the day. {2} When he [Abraham] raised his eyes, then he looked and there three men were standing some distance from him.  When he caught sight of them he began running to meet them from the entrance of the tent and proceeded to bow down to the earth.  {3} Then he said: “Jehovah, if, now, I have found favor in your eyes, please do not pass by your servant.” " (Genesis 18:1-3)


As all reading this thread can see, no mention of Jesus was made in the account with Abraham.  The verses clearly identified "Jehovah" as the person Abraham thought he was speaking to. According to Christendom's Trinity, Jehovah and Jesus are two separate and distinct persons. And according to the account above, it was not the person of Jesus that showed up talking to Abraham.

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Re: Bible Teachings or Traditions of Men?

Post  Alter2Ego on Tue 18 Nov 2014, 6:17 pm

Waqar Daniel wrote:
Alter2Ego wrote:This is confirmed at Colossians 1:15-17 where we are told Jesus was the first to be BORN aka CREATED, after which Jehovah created all other things through or by means of the pre-human Jesus Christ.

"{15} He [Jesus] is the image of the invisible God, the FIRSTBORN OF ALL CREATION; {16} because by means of him [Jesus] all other things were created in the heavens and upon the earth, the things visible and the things invisible, no matter whether they are thrones or lordships or governments or authorities. All other things have been created THROUGH him and for him. {17} Also, he is before all other things and by means of him [Jesus] all other things were made to exist." (Colossians 1:15-17 -- New World Translation)

I asked you that if I use your logic then your parents are your creators and not God because you are born of them and this point is supported by all the definitions you have given from dictionaries.

ALTER2EGO -to- WAQAR DANIEL:

Scripture at Colossians 1:15 says Jesus Christ "firstBORN among EVERY CREATURE."  This indicates the pre-human Jesus Christ was a created being before he even showed up on earth in human form.  


All that nonsense about my parents being creators because they caused my birth is another of your attempts to AVOID being corrected by scripture.  Colossians 1:15 says Jesus Christ is "OF every creature".  The word "OF" indicates Jesus is included among other creatures.  A creature is a created being.  Deal with that.

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Re: Bible Teachings or Traditions of Men?

Post  Waqar Daniel on Tue 18 Nov 2014, 7:06 pm

Alter2Ego wrote:The thing speaks for itself. The fact that you keep using Genesis 1:26 and other similar verses where Jehovah uses the personal pronouns "US" and "OUR" indicates you believe there were no other beings in existence and that God was talking to himself in trinity.
Strange! That is your assumption and you are misquoting me just to prove your lies. Show me the passage where I wrote specifically that I believe that angels were not present at the time of Genesis 1:26. I simply said that God the Father was conversing with Jesus the Son.

One of Us

"In our image" and "has become one of us'

If you state that God was conversing with angels then this make:
  1. angels are equal to God;
  2. they can create;
  3. they can punish;
  4. they can forgive sins;
  5. angels can be worshiped;
  6. their blood can save our souls from hell.


So the question here is - Do you agree with the above mentioned points?

Creation
Who has measured the waters in the hollow of his hand,
or with the breadth of his hand marked off the heavens?
Who has held the dust of the earth in a basket,
or weighed the mountains on the scales
and the hills in a balance?
Who can fathom the Spirit of the Lord,
or instruct the Lord as his counselor?
Whom did the Lord consult to enlighten him,
and who taught him the right way?
Who was it that taught him knowledge,
or showed him the path of understanding?
Surely the nations are like a drop in a bucket;
they are regarded as dust on the scales;
he weighs the islands as though they were fine dust. (Isaiah 40:12-15)
When speaking of God creating the world He asked, “With whom did he take counsel.” So on what grounds can you say that God was conversing with angels in Genesis 1:26???

Genesis 3:22-24
In this chapter of Genesis, there are multiple conversations:

  1. Eve and Serpent;
  2. Lord and Adam;
  3. Lord and Eve.

In the whole chapter Lord no where conversed with the angels
After he drove the man out, he placed on the east side[e] of the Garden of Eden cherubim and a flaming sword flashing back and forth to guard the way to the tree of life. (Genesis 3:24)
The verse 24 clearly states that "After" and this shows that after Jesus conversed with God the Father simply placed angels on the east side of the Garden of Eden.

Who is Equal to God the Father?
For this reason they tried all the more to kill him; not only was he breaking the Sabbath, but he was even calling God his own Father, making himself equal with God. (John 5:18)

My Questions

  1. Are angels equal to God?
  2. Is Jesus Jehovah? If "no" then who is Jesus - A God?
  3. Are your parents your creator?
  4. Why are you avoiding to comment on the verses I quoted? If you think they are irrelevant or are misquoted out of context then prove it.


I hope this time you do answer my questions.

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Re: Bible Teachings or Traditions of Men?

Post  Waqar Daniel on Tue 18 Nov 2014, 7:12 pm

Alter2Ego wrote:All that nonsense about my parents being creators because they caused my birth is another of your attempts to AVOID being corrected by scripture. Colossians 1:15 says Jesus Christ is "OF every creature". The word "OF" indicates Jesus is included among other creatures. A creature is a created being. Deal with that.
Really! You must be joking. You gave definitions from online dictionaries in yur support and I only used your logic therefore it is your logic that is nonsense and stupid why do you blame me? Never try to win discussions on lies and false accusations. Hope to see your answers next time you reply.


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Re: Bible Teachings or Traditions of Men?

Post  Alter2Ego on Tue 18 Nov 2014, 9:13 pm

Waqar Daniel wrote:
Alter2Ego wrote:The thing speaks for itself.  The fact that you keep using Genesis 1:26 and other similar verses where Jehovah uses the personal pronouns "US" and "OUR" indicates you believe there were no other beings in existence and that God was talking to himself in trinity.
Strange! That is your assumption and you are misquoting me just to prove your lies. Show me the passage where I wrote specifically that I believe that angels were not present at the time of Genesis 1:26. I simply said that God the Father was conversing with Jesus the Son.

ALTER2EGO -to- WAQAR DANIEL:

That was responded to in my previous post where you indicated Genesis 1:26 proves Trinity--despite the fact there were millions of angels present at the time.



Waqar Daniel wrote:One of Us

"In our image" and "has become one of us'

If you state that God was conversing with angels then this make:

  1. angels are equal to God;
  2. they can create;
  3. they can punish;
  4. they can forgive sins;
  5. angels can be worshiped;
  6. their blood can save our souls from hell.


Your above attempt to twist my words shows the extent of your refusal to be corrected by Scripture.  

All of the angels are created beings.  Created beings cannot create anything.  So when Jehovah said "let us make man in our image" at Genesis 1:26, he was talking to an angel through whom he (Jehovah) did the creating.  That angel is identified at Colossians 1:15 as the "firstborn OF every CREATURE."   Scripture says Jesus Christ is a creature.  Creatures are created beings, and created beings cannot create--as you have already acknowledged. 


Colossians 1:16-17 says Jehovah did the creating through Jesus.  Jehovah was the power behind the creating.  He simply worked through Jesus.

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Re: Bible Teachings or Traditions of Men?

Post  Alter2Ego on Tue 18 Nov 2014, 10:03 pm

Waqar Daniel wrote:Secondly I asked if Jesus is created then how can a created being become a creator??? So here goes your facts in smoke once again. Kindly answer my questions if you want to further carry on with the discussion.  

ALTER2EGO -to- WAQAR DANIEL:

That question was answered about three different times already.  Colossians 1:16-17 explains that Jehovah did the creating BY MEANS OF or THROUGH Jesus.  So clearly, Jehovah was the power behind the creating of all things.

Before this goes any further, I want to confirm that you believe in the same definition of Trinity as found at the official Trinity source (the Roman Catholic Church).  Below is the official definition of Christendom's Trinity, followed by FOUR (4) questions to you regarding the words bolded in blue within the definition.


Christendom's trinity, written in Article I of The Catholic Faith, is defined as follows:

"There is but one living and true God, everlasting, without body, parts, or passions; of infinite power, wisdom, and goodness; the maker and preserver of all things both visible and indivisible. And in unity of this Godhead there be THREE PERSONS, of one substance, power, and eternity; the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost."
http://www.sevenwholedays.org/2011/03/10/article-i/
http://mb-soft.com/believe/txc/thirtyni.htm


QUESTION #1 to WAQAR DANIEL:  According to Christendom's Trinity, Jesus Christ (the Son) is a different person from Jehovah (the Father), and along with the holy spirit (a third person), they are all three combined into a single "Godhead."  TRUE or FALSE?


"There is but one living and true God, everlasting, without body, parts, or passions; of infinite power, wisdom, and goodness; the maker and preserver of all things both visible and indivisible. And in unity of this Godhead there be three persons, of ONE substance, POWER, and eternity; the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost."

QUESTION #2 to WAQAR DANIEL:  According to Christendom's Trinity, Jesus has the same POWER/is CO-EQUAL with Jehovah the Father.  TRUE or FALSE?


"There is but one living and true God, everlasting, without body, parts, or passions; of infinite power, wisdom, and goodness; the maker and preserver of all things both visible and indivisible. And in unity of this Godhead there be three persons, of ONE substance, power, and ETERNITY; the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost."


QUESTION #3 to WAQAR DANIEL:  According to Christendom's Trinity, Jesus the son is CO-ETERNAL with Jehovah the Father.  TRUE or FALSE?


QUESTION #4 to WAQAR DANIEL:  Do you agree with the official definition of Trinity--that Almighty God is three persons combined into a single "Godhead"?  YES or NO?


Answer those FOUR (4) questions, and then we will proceed.

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Re: Bible Teachings or Traditions of Men?

Post  Waqar Daniel on Fri 28 Nov 2014, 7:14 pm

You have failed to answer a single question I raised. Haven't you read the "Statement of Faith"? I do not  represent Roman Catholics neither I believe in their faith so you only wasted your time.
Alter2Ego wrote:Colossians 1:16-17 says Jehovah did the creating through Jesus.  Jehovah was the power behind the creating.  He simply worked through Jesus.
Your statement shows that you along with other Jehovah Witnesses believe that Jehovah is God the Father. I will be quoting JWs Bible so that you are left with no excuse to make up stories and mislead others.
And Jehovah God made long garments from skins for Adam and for his wife, to clothe them.+ 22  Jehovah God then said: “Here the man has become like one of us in knowing good and bad.+ Now in order that he may not put his hand out and take fruit also from the tree of life+ and eat and live forever,*—” 23  With that Jehovah God expelled him from the garden of E′den+ to cultivate the ground from which he had been taken.+ 24  So he drove the man out, and he posted at the east of the garden of E′den the cherubs+ and the flaming blade of a sword that was turning continuously to guard the way to the tree of life. (Genesis 3:21-24) Jehovah Witness Bible
Then he said: “Jehovah, if I have found favor in your eyes, please do not pass by your servant. (Genesis 18:3) Jehovah Witness Bible
Jehovah spoke to Moses face-to-face,+ just as one man would speak to another man. (Exodus 33:11) Jehovah Witness Bible
Now the question is how many people saw Jehovah in Genesis 3:21-24 and 18:3?

  1. Adam;
  2. Eve;
  3. Abraham;
  4. Moses.

No one has seen the Father except the one who is from God; only he has seen the Father. (John 6:46)
The Bible says no one has seen the Father (Jehovah) I believe that Jehovah Witnesses are really misled by satan as Eve was misled by satan. Not only you are misled by satan but you also try to deceive and mislead others.

_________________


Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the LORD Jesus Christ. (Philemon 1:3)


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Re: Bible Teachings or Traditions of Men?

Post  Alter2Ego on Sat 29 Nov 2014, 8:39 am

Waqar Daniel wrote:
You have failed to answer a single question I raised. Haven't you read the "Statement of Faith"? I do not  represent Roman Catholics neither I believe in their faith so you only wasted your time.
Alter2Ego wrote:Colossians 1:16-17 says Jehovah did the creating through Jesus.  Jehovah was the power behind the creating.  He simply worked through Jesus.
Your statement shows that you along with other Jehovah Witnesses believe that Jehovah is God the Father. I will be quoting JWs Bible so that you are left with no excuse to make up stories and mislead others.
And Jehovah God made long garments from skins for Adam and for his wife, to clothe them.+ 22  Jehovah God then said: “Here the man has become like one of us in knowing good and bad.+ Now in order that he may not put his hand out and take fruit also from the tree of life+ and eat and live forever,*—” 23  With that Jehovah God expelled him from the garden of E′den+ to cultivate the ground from which he had been taken.+ 24  So he drove the man out, and he posted at the east of the garden of E′den the cherubs+ and the flaming blade of a sword that was turning continuously to guard the way to the tree of life. (Genesis 3:21-24) Jehovah Witness Bible
Then he said: “Jehovah, if I have found favor in your eyes, please do not pass by your servant. (Genesis 18:3) Jehovah Witness Bible
Jehovah spoke to Moses face-to-face,+ just as one man would speak to another man. (Exodus 33:11) Jehovah Witness Bible
Now the question is how many people saw Jehovah in Genesis 3:21-24 and 18:3?

  1. Adam;
  2. Eve;
  3. Abraham;
  4. Moses.

No one has seen the Father except the one who is from God; only he has seen the Father. (John 6:46)
The Bible says no one has seen the Father (Jehovah) I believe that Jehovah Witnesses are really misled by satan as Eve was misled by satan. Not only you are misled by satan but you also try to deceive and mislead others.

ALTER2EGO -to- WAQAR DANIEL:

Since you have refused to answer my last four questions, while you continue to play the game of Artful Dodger amidst your usual posting of out-of-context verses, I am out of here.  I do not have time to play your little games.


I might drop by in a few months.  Or maybe I might drop by in another year or two from now.  Who knows?  Until that occurs, I am removing my avatar.

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Re: Bible Teachings or Traditions of Men?

Post  Waqar Daniel on Sun 30 Nov 2014, 5:13 am

You had no answers for my questions so you had to leave. You are more than welcome to come back at any time and I will prove you to be a liar, false preacher and leading others to hell all those who believe lies of Jehovah Witness.
But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be accursed. (Galatians 1:8)
There is no room for you preaching us the lies JWs devise against our faith.

_________________


Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the LORD Jesus Christ. (Philemon 1:3)


Waqar Daniel
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Re: Bible Teachings or Traditions of Men?

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